Interview with Ben Kahn, author of ELLE CAMPBELL WINS THEIR WEEKEND

 

Today's interview is with Ben Kahn (they/them) whose middle grade debut book, Elle Campbell Wins Their Weekend is coming out later this year! Prior to this book they worked as a comic author, so make sure to check those out too! This was a great interview about an absolutely amazing book!

I got to pick Ben's brain about what motivated them to try writing a novel, how they came up with the places that Elle finds themselves in the book, and what they do when they aren't writing. If you want to give Ben a follow their social media links are included below. So are links to preorder their middle grade debut!      

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When did you know that you wanted to be a writer?

I knew I wanted to be a writer when I was a freshman in college. I remember exactly the restaurant booth I was sitting in when I was reading Sandman, and the thought popped into my head wondering if I could tell stories too. I’ve kinda been spending all that time trying to answer that question. I love writing, getting to tell stories and challenge myself is an absolute joy.

Ooh, okay! Never heard a story like that one but I love it!!!

You originally wrote comics, how did you get involved with that line of work?

I’ve been making comics since I was doing four-panel strips as a high schooler that I put together in Microsoft Paint. I just love comics, I think they’re one of the coolest things in the universe. Getting to come up with stories and seeing amazing artists put their own vision into it is an amazing experience. As I got older and read more, the more I wanted to write bigger, different things. That spirit of challenging myself and growing eventually brought me to prose and Elle Campbell, but I’ll always have so much love for comics.

Comics are absolutely amazing and I love them! I love that you started there, with something you love so much!

What made you want to make the jump from writing comics to writing a novel?

I love writing comics, and I always will, but I think it’s important to keep challenging myself and striving to grow as a writer. So when the opportunity came to try my hand at something new, I jumped at it. Tackling prose, middle grade, slice-of-life, these were all new experiences for me. It was a great chance to write new kinds of characters, incorporate new influences, and tell a story unlike anything I’d done before. It was thrilling and challenging, and I wouldn’t have it any other way.

That's a great reason to start writing longer things and new ideas. I'm thrilled about it.

Your novel, Elle Campbell Wins Their Weekend, as well as one of your comics, Gryffen, feature nonbinary/genderqueer main characters. What made you want to include this representation in your stories?

The big answer is simply that I’m non-binary, and I wanted to see that identity in the stories I tell. I think maybe if I’d had more examples of non-binary identity in stories, maybe there’s a chance I would have pieced things together earlier and saved myself a lot of years of grief. And non-binary people are awesome, we deserve to see ourselves in all sorts of out-there adventures.

Fair enough! I feel much the same way about nonbinary identities in stories. That we're awesome but also that it could have saved me a lot of questioning. Books with nonbinary characters in them often wind up being some of my favorite books.

How did you come up with the idea for Elle Campbell?

When it comes to slice of life, my favorites were always the movies that covered a really small slice of time, zoomed in on the day in the life of. Your Ferris Bueller, Breakfast Club, Dazed and Confused, those were big inspirations, Ferris Bueller’s Day Off most of all. I was definitely trying to capture and updated John Hughes type of vibe with Elle Campbell. So that’s a lot of the storytelling DNA, and then plus a lot of my own memories of growing up in the suburbs and how much fun it was just getting into mischief and breaking all the silly rules that adults throw in kids’ way.

Ooh I've only seen Ferris once but I definitely see how that worked as an inspiration. But I also love that some of your personal experience and memories played a part in the mischief-making too!!

Elle’s icon is Nuri Grena from the show Phantom Thief. Phantom Thief seems to be a very interesting show, where did the idea for that show come from? Is it a mixture of other shows or something else?

Phantom Thief is mostly based off of Doctor Who. That’s where the whole idea of a long-running sci-fi series where the main character shifts into a new identity came from. I haven’t seen much of Doctor Who, but the lore and the passion that fandom has is really something amazing. It was really fun coming up with all these fun references to fictional episodes where any whacky sci-fi premise may be going down. I know I can definitely relate to having that show, or book, or movie that just blows you away and becomes your whole world (I was a big Final Fantasy and Dragon Ball kid myself).

Fair! I had a feeling that might have been one of the ideas for the character. I don't watch the show but there are certain lore from it that I know because of how often people talk about it.

On the topic of Nuri Grena, are they based on anyone? Not necessarily their specific personality but who they are in relation to Elle.

Nuri is really based off of every celebrity who took that step to be themself, and showed generations of people how to be themselves and to embrace who they are. They’re for everyone who could only find role models in the fictional, but being fiction didn’t make their impact any less real or important. Some real inspirations are definitely Anthony Rapp and Wilson Cruz for their work bringing queer representation to Star Trek, as well as the wonderful non-binary actors living their truth and making their mark like Vico Ortiz, Bella Ramsey and Mason Alexander Park.

I love it!!! I want more people like that at the forefront of media. I love when you can see the representation and have role models like that.

How did you come up with the major locations for Nuri’s signing where Elle and her friends inevitably found themselves at?

I had a lot of fun coming up with all the places Elle visits across town trying to reach one of Nuri’s signings. My main source of inspiration was the stops Ferris Bueller made on his day of escaping school, and combined that with my own childhood memories. Plus making sure that every location offered plenty of opportunity for fun shenanigans. I couldn’t have Elle go to a Chicago Cubs game, so that became the batting cages my Dad took me to when I was a kid. And I had to put our chaos goblin protagonists in a place as prim and proper as an art museum. The most important location to get right was the book store. The local book store was my haven growing up, as I think it was for many a nerdy kid, and I really wanted to capture that warm, inviting atmosphere.

Some of the locations were a lot of fun. Like letting those kids just go feral in a museum! I definitely get the bookstore part being important. My safe haven was always a library, it's just such a welcoming and sage environment.

The conversation towards the end of the book between Nuri and Elle is honestly amazing! How did that conversation develop over time? What parts of it did you know needed to be included from the beginning?

What I wanted to show with meeting Nuri was that despite Elle having to figure out being non-binary on their own for so much of the book, they’re not alone. They’re part of a great and wonderful tradition of being. There are people to help and inspire them, just like Elle will help and inspire people in their life.

I knew that it was important that Nuri not have all the answers. As much as they’re this aspirational, heroic icon to Elle, I still wanted to make sure I showed them as human. They’re someone who has most certainly gone through their own doubts and frustrations, just like Elle has. And I wanted to show that it was okay not to have all the answers, that it’s enough to just keep being our marvelous selves.

It was such a well-written scene, I absolutely love that conversation between the two of them. You did a great job at making them someone who can give advice without being someone who has all the answers. They're supportive and welcoming and sweet.

How did the character/personality of Elle Campbell develop from the first draft of the book to the final draft?

Elle stayed largely the same to how I first conceived them. They were always clever, nerdy, loyal to their friends, and trying their best to make sense of their fluid identity.

I’d say what changed in the drafts was Elle’s central conflict. How Elle wound up in detention and what they wanted Nuri’s help with changed as the book evolved. Originally it started out as more general worries, how to feel valid in a binary society, how to present, that kind of thing. But as I was writing, we realized those worries didn’t feel right for where Elle is in their journey. When we find Elle, they’re very confident in their pronouns, and are well on their way to developing a wonderful style all their own. So instead we honed in the struggle of standing up for yourself in the face of people who don’t understand you, or don’t want to understand.

Definitely makes sense how the conflict changed over the edits. The Elle you wrote definitely seems sure about who they are and what they want to be seen as, but has trouble finding a way to stand up for themselves. I get it, I'm much the same.

How would you describe the vibes of Elle Campbell?

It’s giving suburban adventure realness. I want Elle Campbell to evoke those long days of hanging out with your friends. It’s fun and it’s mischief and finding yourself while making memories that will last a lifetime.

YES!! Those are the vibes perfectly!!!

What was the hardest scene or your favorite scene in this book to write? Why?

Just on an emotional level, Elle having to deal with the substitute teacher who mis-genders and yells at them was a punch in the gut to write. I love Elle, and it broke my heart putting them through that.

Yeah that makes sense. Broke my heart to read that, but it was such an important scene at the same time.

What’s been the best part about writing and publishing your debut novel?

The best part about writing and publishing my debut novel has been getting to tell a story that’s meant a lot to me. It’s a story I think I could only have told in prose. Working in prose, it’s like a whole new universe to explore has opened up, and I couldn’t be more excited.

I'm glad to hear that!! It's so important to get to tell those stories! I wish you the best in any future prose endeavors!

Do you like to have any specific snacks or drinks or otherwise that you like to keep on hand while writing?

When I sit down to write, I love to have a cup of tea with milk and honey. It’s warm and cozy and I don’t know why exactly, but it always puts me in the right mindset to get good work done.

Ooh, that sounds really good!

How do you motivate yourself to push past writer’s block or just when you hit a wall?

Deadlines are definitely a great motivator (pause for laughter). I’d say my real answer is embracing the importance of the away-from-keyboard time in the writing process. I find there’s only so much of a story I can write down at a time. I’ll have a portion of it in my head, get that down in writing, but then I need to step away from the keyboard to plan out that next portion of the story. For me, so much of the raw act of figuring out story beats has happened while out on a walk or listening to music in the car.

Definitely see how they can be a good motivator. That makes a lot of sense actually! Going for a walk or listening to music probably helps remove any of the "staring at a blank page" anxiety that might try and happen.

Are you currently working on any other novels or comics?

I’ve got a few things in the works! Most of what I’m working on is in the comics space, but I think I’ll be splitting my time between comics and prose more and more. I can’t formally announce anything yet, but there’s a lot of fun stuff in the works, including new graphic novels for Middle Grade and YA readers.

Count me in! I'm here for any comics or prose that you write in the future! I'll keep an eye out for your name for any announcements!

When you’re not writing, what do you like to do?

Between my day job and writing there’s not a ton of time for hobbies, but I do try my best to fit some in. The main thing I try to do each day is exercise. I enjoy it, keeps me active, and I do a lot of good story thinking when I’m working out. I also love to cook. It’s nice having something creative that’s a little more lowkey (ie - no deadlines). I’ve also got a very cute kitty who needs lots of cuddle of time, so that has to come first. And then other than that I also maintain a weekly horror movie podcast called Progressively Horrified that’s a lot of fun.

Fair enough! Exercise is quite good at getting the juices flowing. Aww, kitty cuddles!!!!!!

Thank you so much Ben for taking part in this interview! I greatly appreciate you taking the time to do this with me and I look forward to anything you put out in the future! Also, thank you to everyone who read this! You can find Ben's social media links a bit further below and you can also find the link to preorder a copy of Elle Campbell below!

If you like what I do, consider giving me a follow on my social media or consider sharing or donating my GCLS GoFundMe. I appreciate any help or shares that I can get! Every little bit matters. Thank you for reading!!

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You can find Ben Kahn on their website, Twitter, and Instagram.

You can preorder Elle Campbell from Barnes & Noble. You can also preorder it from other stores that sell books!
You can also buy Ben Kahn's comics from their website.

If you can't buy their books but you still want to read them, consider requesting them to your local library or suggesting them on Overdrive!